Garage Gazette
VEHICLES => PROJECT CARS/TRUCKS => Topic started by: Der Bugmeister on February 18, 2022, 10:51:20 PM
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I'm sure I posted the story and photos of this car here somewhere, but darned if I can find it now. Possibly lost in one of the forum crashes I guess. Anyhow, 5 years ago I bought a 1970 Cutlass S that had been sitting untouched in a storage locker for 20 years. The car was complete, the body and paint had been done not long before it was parked and it had a non-original 260 V8 in the engine bay. Front disc brakes from a 1969 442.
One of the previous owners had removed all the Oldsmobile and Cutlass badging, and put the 4 4 2 numbers on the hood tooth. Yes, they're supposed to be straight but the guy thought they looked funky like that.
I was expecting an unrealistically high price on the car after years of paying storage on it, but his asking price was incredibly low...so we shook on it. He threw in a bunch of other stuff including a core SBO 350 which have since been sold and reduce the overall purchase price even more.
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We aired up the tires, rolled the car into the sunlight for the first time in 20 years, primed the oil, cleaned the points and fed her some clean gas. She started relatively easily and sounded better the more we let her idle. The brakes were present...although more of a suggestion than anything resembling a real stopping force. I drove her home (about a 15 minute drive) then made a couple runs through town with the family onboard. Only had a one day pumpkin permit.
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Once home, she got her first bath in 20 years. Yes, that was drywall tape hanging from the ceiling and clumps of paste on the hood back at the storage locker. Cleaned up great.
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After that day of attention, she went into hibernation in the shop while I debated what I wanted to do with her. Replacing the engine was a definite intention, so the 260 and transmission came out a few years ago. The initial plan was to replace it with a strong running 350 for the short term, then eventually upgrade to a 455. Long story short, I figured the 455 probably wouldn't happen if I got her running with the 350 so the engine bay is still empty to this day.
In the interim I sourced some 442 grills to replace the nearly new Cutlass Supreme grills and replaced the late '70s GM Rally wheels with original Oldsmobile SS2 wheels (14" front, 15" back). I had a 442 wing painted satin black and mounted that on the trunklid and have an aftermarket OAI (scooped hood) hood for a more aggressive look. I also picked up a donor car with a black bucket seat interior (http://garagegazette.com/index.php?topic=819.0) and some other parts to swap.
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After retiring from the Navy, I got a couple nice lump sum payments for pain and suffering, some of which is being diverted to building this car the way I want it. This is something I only get to do once, and I'm gonna do it right. Acquiring the car itself was remarkably inexpensive. You couldn't do the metal work on a rusty car for what I paid. This makes it easier to spend a lot of money on the drivetrain, when I wouldn't usually want to do it. I'm building this for me, not for resale value!
Here's the plan:
Engine: Rebuilt 455 pushing upwards of 500 HP and over 500 ft lbs torque. I'm sourcing most of the parts from Bernard Mondello Racing and having a local shop do the machining, assembly, break in and dyno. This will probably be the biggest slow down factor of the build - waiting for parts and for the build.
Transmission: Tremec TKX 5 speed with hydraulic clutch. This is a relatively new transmission design and fits the GM A bodies without tunnel modifications. The vendor that will be supplying the transmission also provides a complete conversion kit for switching from automatic to manual trans. The donor car will provide everything needed to delete the column shift...steering column/housing, speedometer without the PRNDSL, console.
Rear end: GM 8.5" 10 bolt posi upgrade
Interior: Convert from white bench seat interior to black bucket seat interior. Plus sound proofing, stereo, etc
I had a decent 1969 455 candidate which had been sitting for about 17 or so years now. Tore it down, looks like it's had some work done in the past (rod bearings are .010 under and rods have machinist's markings). The crank was a CN casting which seems to be desirable. Olds 455s had unmarked castings, N or Nodular castings and CN castings which are also Nodular. Depending on who you talk to, the CN is better or the CN and the N are both the same. Both are better than the unmarked ones.
The block and crank are with my machinist now for hot tanking and suitability assessment. Once the crank gets the thumbs up, it will be sent through a friend to be drilled out for the manual transmission pilot bearing.
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The current rear end is an O type open diff, unique to Oldsmobiles and having very limited aftermarket support or options while the donor car had what appeared to be a 8.5" 10 bolt posi unit and factory boxed control arms. The ratio turned out to be 2.73 which is way to low for the 5 speed. The rear end appears to be a Buick unit based on the axle stamping, and had a Borg Warner split case posi unit, and 28 spline bolt in axles instead of the C Clips. Although I found someone who could rebuild the posi unit, it does appear the cones are worn and the overall recommendation/sentiment is to replace it all.
I had another Olds posi rear end as an option, but it's 3.08 gearing and limited support was still out of the range I wanted for the 5 speed. So the GM 10 bolt has been removed from the blue donor car and replaced with the spare rear end. This allows me to keep the project car as a roller until the new rear end is together. The donor car is still drivable - the 350 sounds and feels good, the transmission works but there are no brakes. One of my friends is helping me with a lot of this work and will be buying that car from me once I've got the parts I want from it. I'll be replacing the "stolen" parts with the ones they replace on the project and the goal is to maintain the donor car as a viable driver/project.
I'm looking at a 3.73 ratio based on the recommendation from my transmission vendor, 30 spline Moser axles and either a Yukon or Eaton posi carrier. That should all come together in the next month and in the meantime the axle housing will get sandblasted and painted along with various rear suspension components.
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And this brings us up to date. I'm waiting for information on the block and crank from my machinist then will be ordering all the shiny go fast parts soon...then waiting impatiently as some of the parts are potentially 6 months out. I think I'm ready to order the transmission and rear end parts next week.
The first new part did arrive recently...the intake I wanted had been out of stock for a while until recently, so we got that in.
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Love the shiny Edelbrock intake manifold that always looks so beautiful when you open the box.
Thanks for the update and are the VWs pretty much limited to drivers now? It is great that you are building your desired car how you want it. I hope it all comes together for you with no major snags.
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Love the shiny Edelbrock intake manifold that always looks so beautiful when you open the box.
Thanks for the update and are the VWs pretty much limited to drivers now? It is great that you are building your desired car how you want it. I hope it all comes together for you with no major snags.
Yeah, love the shine! Kind of a symbolic step at this point, but good to be moving in the right direction. It will be even better when all the other new shiny parts start arriving...and ultimately once they're combined to "fly" in unison.
I've been down to a single VW for some time now (although I do have a '58 rolling shell that's a good project for someone not me at the moment). I'm hoping to be able to keep the '57 sunroof Bug but am reluctantly prepared to part with it if I need extra funds to bring this Cutlass project to a close without cutting corners. I had the Bug insured last summer but only drove it a handful of times...it needs some work and problem solving to become a reliable driver again. I hadn't insured it for the year or two before that, partially due to the 'vid reducing driving opportunities.
I don't know how much I'd wind up driving it once the brute is finished, although the Bug will certainly be easier on the gas budget. If I do manage to retain the Bug, I'd like to do a nut and bolt restoration on it after the Cutlass is done. I've been collecting parts for that for years now.
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looks great. i grew up driving olds cars. i drove a 79 delta 88 for years and had an 87 cutlass as well and then an i would guess about a 90 cutlass supreme international. my parents had several as well. nothing like yours but i really wish i had never sold the 87.[email][/email]
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Very nice! My father in law has a Red 69 he's been working on get out of the barn and back on the road.
Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk
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Mmmmmmnewwwww partsssss :)
I decided to go all new components. This allowed me to upgrade to 30 spline Moser axles and move away from the worn, less desirable split case posi. I now have a Yukon Dura Grip posi, 3.73 gears and the 30 spline bolt in (no C clips here) Moser axles.
I sourced these parts from JD Race in Ohio, and he saved me more than a couple hundred dollars over buying these through some place like Summit Racing. Highly recommended if you happen to be looking.
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I still have to clean and paint the axle housing before I can get this reassembled and under the car.
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Wise to upgrade, Moser axle good stuff run them in the coupe... Rear ends are the next heaviest item after the engine. The Ford 9 is a real elephant.
C clip, you jamming in a Ford rear under there? If GM, I have seen that upgrade, great upgrade. Intense, you must be jumping to disc? Measure 4 times and cut LOL
What's standard in the 442 10/12 bolt, 3.72 same gear in the mustang, you have a manual box? If not no matter still fun with auto.
Got a good build going for ya
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I considered swapping to a Ford 9", but the entire project is already blowing past my initial budget especially with how prices are going up these days. This is all going into my GM corporate 8.5" housing. There were a couple years in 1971/72 where these rear ends used bolt-in axles without C Clips, and this is rear end is one of them. Saved me from having to get the Moser C Clip eliminator setup.
There doesn't seem to have been any standard rear end in 442s, or Olds in general. Between the O Type (Olds specific) and the various corporate types and sizes even identifying one can be a bit of a challenge without digging into it. None of my cars are 442s, just Cutlasses...and the rear end I'm using has Buick axle stampings so possible originally sourced from a '72 Skylark! The donor Cutlass had some major reconstructive work done many years ago so the swap might have been done then.
I'll be getting the Tremec TKX 5 speed...manual is so much more fun to drive :) The TKX slips right into the A body without having to do any tunnel modifications.
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excellent ideas for that 442 Clay. Can't wait to see some pics -- Good luck!
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excellent ideas for that 442 Clay. Can't wait to see some pics -- Good luck!
Thanks, Ray. Definitely more photos to come. I think my wife is looking forward to having this car on the road almost as much as I am! (As long as she doesn't see the bills blowing the budget out of the water, methinks :-D )
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Looks like you have a really nice build going. Can’t wait to see some photos of your progress.
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Looks like you have a really nice build going. Can’t wait to see some photos of your progress.
Thanks, Jerry. Nothing has happened on the car since my last update but I've been working on some shop setup to move things along better. The Tremec TKX 5 speed should be here by the end of the week and I'll toss up some photos of what's included with that pretty quick.
I have to dig into the interior next, though, and get my order in for new seat covers, door panels, carpeting and sound deadener in the next week or so. Engine is still many months away though.
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Of course I can't have a car like this without some kick butt tunes! One thing I'm finding with the current supply chain issues and impending inflationary concerns is that the time to buy pieces is now. Prices are likely to be more favourable and if you have to wait longer than usual for an item it's better to be waiting when it's not actually needed yet. As I've mentioned, the engine is still a long ways out but there's plenty of other bits to be bought.
Today I put together the sound system with the knowledgeable guidance of a good friend (as in he said "This is what you need"). I was happy with what he set me up with in my other Cutlass and this rig is even better.
JVC KD-T915BTS head unit
Kenwood KAC-M8005 Class D 5 Channel Amp
Rockford Fosgate P152-S Two way component speakers (for the front/doors)
Rockford Fosgate P1694 Four way 6x9 speakers for the back
2 x Rockford Fosgate Punch 10" Subwoofers
Cables and stuff
The store tossed in that sub enclosure for free, although I don't think it's going to work in my car. We'll build a custom fit enclosure instead.
My friend will be doing the installation with my help (I'll pass the tools, pass the beer and ask irritating questions) but there's plenty of work to be done before we reach that point. Picking up the transmission tomorrow and will share photos of those parts soon.
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Exciting day today, picking up and unpacking the transmission. I had originally wanted to find the correct Muncie M21 and do a period correct conversion to manual, but parts can be hard to come by in my area and honestly, I just didn't feel like trying to chase down 50 year old used parts hoping they were A) correct and B) in good condition. I'm starting with a bench seat, column shift automatic car which means I needed everything - transmission, bellhousing, shifter, clutch pedal, Z-Bar, etc etc. The idea of a brand new transmission with all new conversion/installation parts had great appeal to me.
The donor car has the bucket seats and console I'll need as well as the steering column and speedometer (without the PRDSL indicator), although I think I have another column housing in my parts stash...and may use all aftermarket gauges in the dash for a cleaner finish. More on that later.
I need to source a 4 speed saddle to convert the automatic shift console for use with the stick, and probably a couple other console pieces just for restoration.
I decided on the Tremec TKX 5-speed transmission which is rated for 600 ft lbs of torque, 8000 engine RPMs and shifts up to 7500 RPM. The design is just a couple of years old and will bolt straight into the GM A Bodies (and many others) without having to do any tunnel modifications. Well, apart from cutting a hole for the shifter.
There are many Tremec vendors and I went with Silver Sport Transmissions in Rockford, Tennessee mostly because I liked the look of their full conversion kit. I also opted for a hydraulic clutch which I think my knees will thank me for in years to come. SST was great to deal with - very responsive to calls, good information, fast shipping and confirmation emails. Everything was well packed too.
It was like a second Christmas as I dug into the four boxes these goodies arrived in! Of course the biggest box was the transmission itself, snuggled in with assorted documentation. I can't disagree with the warning label on the box O:-)
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Box 2 contained the McLeod Racing flywheel, pressure plate and clutch disc while the third box had all the necessary fluids. I guess I'll have to RTFM to find out what the ATF is for!
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The last box held plenty of goodies. The hydraulic clutch components, bellhousing and cover, pedals, stick, shifter ball, installation hardware, etc. This gonna be fun!
There's a local fellow who makes custom shifter knobs, some sort of acrylic material...I'll probably see what he can come up with eventually.
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Finally time for a bit of daytime dreaming...as you can see there's a lot of work between the current reality and my dreamstate of banging gears in this car. I'm getting a lot of parts stacked up but still need to dig into the interior and wait for the engine. Plenty of work to be done in the engine bay as well, including a new wiring harness.
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Very cool Clay!
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I missed the earlier post. Good choices on the audio equipment . I had a preference for old school Rockford fosgate equipment.
I used alpine head units and eq to to run a punch 45 and 75 for the front and rear and a 150 bridged mono to run a pair of pro 10 subs.
One of the best systems I ever heard was owned by a guy with a small import car. I can't even recall what it was but he ran a punch 45 with a pair of 2 way speakers in s and a 10 inch sub bridged mono. It all just worked.
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I've got Rockford Fosgate 6x9's in the back and 5" in the doors of my other Cutlass, they belt the sound out pretty decent with a single 10" sub. I think this new system will be slightly dangerous lol.
Went to a swap meet last weekend to see what was there to be seen. I don't normally find much in the way of Oldsmobile parts at the local ones, so I had to do a double take when I saw a nice set of headers for sale and had to triple check that they were for 455s and would fit a 1970 Cutlass. Shockingly, they're exactly what I needed...brand new, ceramic coated. The brand is Patriot which is owned by Pertronix. I had been planning on buying some American Racing Headers (top notch) which would have cost me about $2,000 Cdn all in, but these ones were a quarter of that price at $500. I figured they were worth taking a chance!
I'm still waiting for the final bill on my main engine parts package from Bernard Mondello Racing Enterprises but things are in motion there. Probably won't see the parts until later in August or early September but at least it looks like the Edelbrock heads may be finally shipping after a two year wait.
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Meanwhile, I've decided to remove the front fenders and core support to make cleaning/painting/detailing a lot easier along with making life easier for installing the hydraulic clutch and eventually the engine/transmission combo.
The car presents quite nicely although it will never be a contender for best paint or anything which is fine by me. But, I do like to know the areas you don't see are as clean as where you can see, so I've never understood when people do half assed jobs like this. The fender looks great from the outside, but inside you can see surface rust circles resulting from some heat shrinking during the bodywork. If you're going to do the outside properly, why would you leave easily accessible backside areas open to early rust through? Irritating. I'll deal with that sort of thing before reassembly.
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Be careful with Mondello , a friend of mine had a bad experience with them.
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Cool pics -- thanks for the update Clay.
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Be careful with Mondello , a friend of mine had a bad experience with them.
There are two Mondellos - Mondello Performance in Paso Robles and Bernard Mondello Racing Enterprises in Corona. Mondello Performance is the one your friend would have had a bad experience with. Although that company was founded by the legendary Joe Mondello, it was purchased by Lynn Welfringer when Joe retired. I've seen copious amounts of bad experiences posted dealing with them about quality, customer service and more.
Bernard Mondello is Joe's son and has a solid reputation for high quality parts and service. He learned head work and machining from Joe growing up and working with his dad through the years...and this is who I'm buying the parts from.
So definitely an excellent warning...I wouldn't buy a used nail from Lynn!
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Cool pics -- thanks for the update Clay.
More to come, thanks for looking!!!
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Yep your right it was lynn.
I did meet Joe one day was a terrific bloke.
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Fenders, bumper and core support removed. This will make access for cleaning and painting the firewall and frame a lot easier. While it's apart, I'll be installing the hydraulic clutch and new engine bay wiring. Core support and inside of fenders will also be cleaned and painted. So much for a quick engine swap :))
I'll probably switch to the interior before doing much else here, as it's coming out for a complete swap/refresh as well. The blue parts car has the black bucket seats and console that will be installed here. Part of the conversion is changing out the speedometer to one without the automatic gear selector indicator (although I'll probably be replacing all gauges with Speedhut ones anyhow) and the steering column. I'd like to move the blue car on to it's next owner, but not before I use it for a template to position the console mounting brackets and bucket seat mount locations. And guess where that steering column is coming from as well.
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Clay, thanks for the update. Looks like you are making progress. I am enjoying following along with your journey!
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Once upon a time, my father had a '70 Cutlass. His was the Supreme (the sorta "notchback" model) in 2 dr Ht.
350 Rocket, auto trans. Gold color car with white buckets and console shift. Wish I had bought it off him when he traded it
Nicest car he ever owned
At the same time, my brother had a 69 Cutlass S, which underwent a few changes from the 2 bbl 350 it came with and was FAST!
I envy you for this project
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Clay, thanks for the update. Looks like you are making progress. I am enjoying following along with your journey!
Glad you're enjoying it! Things have been stalled for the last month as my full time and attention were being given to organizing a car show and a few other events (I'm president of the show which translates to "who's dumb enough to do most of the work"). The show (and rod run) were held last weekend and were a great success...so now I have more time to turn back to the Cutlass.
Once upon a time, my father had a '70 Cutlass. His was the Supreme (the sorta "notchback" model) in 2 dr Ht.
350 Rocket, auto trans. Gold color car with white buckets and console shift. Wish I had bought it off him when he traded it
Nicest car he ever owned
At the same time, my brother had a 69 Cutlass S, which underwent a few changes from the 2 bbl 350 it came with and was FAST!
I envy you for this project
Both cars sound great, Chuck! I'm more partial to the fastback body style but the Supremes are beautiful too. All the parts from the back of the door forward are the same between the two models.
I've been searching for someone to assemble my rear end...it's beyond my skill set and I want to know it's done right. I have a couple of leads so hoping they'll pan out! Haven't heard from my engine parts source lately but I know the heads are in at any rate. Some of the other parts are made to order which of course results in a bit of a wait. The initial timeline suggested I should see them all in early September (maybe). Then who knows how long for assembly!
The biggest task in the next couple of weeks will be ordering parts. Lots of parts. Interior, suspension, miscellaneous bits and pieces.
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This thread has brought back a lot of memories for a few people.
My first car, a 1968 Cutlass, that was totaled by a city snow plow/dump truck vehicle, in the middle of summer (crested the hill and rear ended me, picked up the back end 6') and now the person that I dealt with, is our mayor. (it was interesting for both of us, because some restriction required them to pay for a rental car, and who is going to rent a car to a 17 year old)
At least once a year, I have a dream where I pull it out of the garage and drive it for a week, and at the end of the week, I have enjoyed it and am bitching about the cost of gas to drive it.
Then I had a discussion with some friends, and we got on the subject of swivel seats. His first car, he bought new when he went pro, was a 75, 442, with t tops and swivel seats. His poor buddy, went to live on a farm while doing his stuff and was given an old beat to hell, 50's chevy farm pickup with no seats, which he drove with 5 gallon bucket, "swivel seats".
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Friend of mine had a Monte Carlo with swivel buckets.
I don’t ever remember him swiveling them to get out of his car.
Probably not one of GMs brighter ideas but it was a unique idea!
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Progressing slowly. Took the rear end housing to a friend for sandblasting and paint, now it looks nice and shiny. The housing and all the new parts are now with the fellow I found to assemble it all so it won't be much longer before I'll be working to get it under the car.
I've been pulling the interior out and everything is looking solid and reasonably clean so far. Some areas with surface rust that I'll clean up and hit with POR15 or something before applying the sound proofing. Haven't figured out what all I need to replace as far as interior pieces go, and I hear Legendary has up to a 9 month wait period from order to delivery. I should be able to use most of the other car's black interior at least in the interim. Still plenty to be done before the interior goes back in, though. Swap steering columns, position console mounting brackets, cut hole for stick shift, position bucket seat mounting points, install hydraulic clutch and wire up the new stereo.
My engine parts (except the heads) are on the way and should be in my hands in a week or so. Reviews of the new Edelbrock heads were a bit disappointing so I decided to wait about 6 months for them in order to have Bernard Mondello blueprint them. Not cheap, but well worth it. Once I finish drooling over all the nice (and damned expensive) hardware, I'll drop it off with my engine builder so he can have everything ready before the heads arrive.
There's still a long laundry list of other systems to order - fuel system (tank, pickup, fuel lines), new gauge packages, under hood wiring to name a few) and still on the fence whether to use the current Oldsmobile SS2 rims or splurge for something aftermarket.
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He did a great job on that rear axle Clay. It's a shame that all that good work won't be very visible once everything is installed.
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I said the same thing to him, Ray!
I'll be replacing the cover with a repro aluminum W-27 one so everyone eating my dust will have some bling to look at :))
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No time to work on the car this past month, but spent my time volunteering for a local Haunted House which raised over $67,000 for local charities. Time well spent, IMO!
But, the clock is ticking on this project. I still want to be driving this beast during the 2023 car season (the more of it, the better). Most of my engine parts arrived last week so they'll be dropped off at the engine builder in the next few days. The heads won't be here for a few months yet but he can get going on the bottom end in the meantime.
- CP/Bullet pistons, .030 over
- Scat H-Beam rods
- BMRE (Bernard Mondello Racing Enterprises) roller cam (from Howard's Cams) and lifters with 4/7 swap
- BJH Billet harmonic balancer
- Cloyes for BMRE billet true roller timing chain set
- Harland Sharp 1.6 ratio roller rockers
- ARP cylinder head bolts, main studs, upgraded 7/16 rocker studs
- BMRE 7 quart high volume oiling system (pan, blueprinted pump, pickup, oil pump drive and mounting studs)
- Full length windage tray with adjustable stand off studs
- BMRE/Cometic head gaskets
- BMRE complete gasket set
- Complete MSD Ignition System (distributor, coil pack, plug wires)
- Quick Fuel SS850 carb (mechanical secondaries, electric choke)
...and a couple other odds and ends.
I also bought a set of GM Performance Products cast tall valve covers. I have a NOS pair of stock dimension aluminum Holley covers but unsure whether they'll fit over the valve train. I like the looks of these GMPP covers a lot better. Just need to decide how I want to finish them up instead of the current raw cast appearance.
I need to clean and paint the assorted brackets, get new engine mounts, new waterpump, alternator and steering fluid reservoir (who wants grimy old parts on this engine???) and sort out my cooling options.
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Yep, kind of like an early Christmas at Der Oldsmeister's place! Here are a couple more photos.
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Exciting times eh!!
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Exciting times eh!!
Some nights I just lay awake dreaming with my eyes open!
I picked up my rear end on Sunday, it looks good. Waiting for a friend to help me unload it then I'll share some photos of that. In the meantime, kids will play. Latest delivery...and there's no valid justification for me to put these on the car except to give myself the opportunity to further unleash the little kid in me...besides, some of my friends have them :-D
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When your finished that one i`ve got your next project ready.
1970 Buick 455 GS 4 spd with a/c in Aqua mist with a white top.
Project car comes with 2 other 70 buicks fo parts.
Road trip >:D :08:
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When your finished that one i`ve got your next project ready.
1970 Buick 455 GS 4 spd with a/c in Aqua mist with a white top.
Project car comes with 2 other 70 buicks fo parts.
Road trip >:D :08:
You're killing me here! :cool2:
My '57 VW will be next unless I wind up selling it at some point...then there's my '71 Cutlass that would get a stock treatment until my daughter takes possession of it at some point in the future.
Here's the assembled rear end photos. I need to blast and paint the backing plates, get a fancy cover and figure out a few other things before it goes under the car. All new components - Yukon posi, 3.73 gears, Moser 30 spline axles, new pinion yoke.
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Well, I think any hopes of new rims are going to have to be shelved for now. This thing just keeps going cha-ching cha-ching cha-outgoing moola, and doesn't help that the Canadian dollar is pretty weak right now!
I'm not sure if I actually need those fancy new tall valve covers to clear the rockers, but I do like their appearance over any other option and I like knowing there won't be any issues with the rockers. The downside is that they're 4" taller than the stock covers which leads to other clearance issues. The 11" brake booster tries to occupy the same space, and even an 8" would require doing some material removal off the covers...something I'd rather avoid. Not wanting to give up the power brakes, the solution seems to be a hydroboost braking system. A friend of mine is running a Hydratech setup on his 64 Lemans and likes it, so I think I'll be doing the same.
I've also been having doubts about the adequacy of the 2 row aluminum radiator I have, and what kind of fan (electric or crank mounted) to use. Either would need a fanshroud added. Another friend (beautiful '69 Firebird convertible) has a BeCool radiator, and I've been reading good things about those...so looks like I will wind up grabbing a full BeCool Factory Fit assembly for this.
Gauge wise, I'm looking at either Dakota Digital or Speedhut, and really leaning towards the Speedhut option as being better looking although a couple hundred bucks more. Top image is Dakota, bottom is Speedhut with a personalized graphic added to the face.
So those three systems have added significantly to costs, but I don't think I'll be happy going a cheaper route on such important systems. I still have to sort out my interior requirements and have a lengthy list of smaller items, the kind that tend to nickel and dime you to death the closer you are to the finish line.
In the meantime I'm trying to unbury the actual car from the mounds of VW parts I bought recently. Buy low, sell high...need to sell a lot to pay for this build!!!
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Christmas certainly got in the way of things! But I did order a few things and progressed work.
The Hydratech brake boost system is on order, apparently takes 90-120 days to ship as each one is made to order. I went with the Speedhut gauges (lower ones shown in my last post). While the Dakota Digital seem to have good reviews, their appearance just doesn't do it for me. Those should ship in another 2 or 3 weeks.
The single biggest piece of the puzzle is still the heads; not sure when they'll be on their way but probably at least another 3 months.
On the bright side, I just picked up my new fuel pump (good for up to 550 HP), fuel pickup with 1/2" tubes and 8-AN fittings along with an inline micron filter from RobbMC. Purty fancy piece of kit...should keep my thirsty girl sated!
In other news, I've removed pretty much everything forward of the firewall now, and the steering column/interior. Lots of cleaning, prepping and painting in my immediate future! Also well along the way in removing the interior from my donor car. Things are looking pretty good, although not perfect...but certainly useable if I have to wait for restoration pieces. The front wheels will be coming apart to paint the backing plates and install the Wilwood disc brake upgrades as well.
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It's a tight fit in the shop right now...my car inventory kind of exploded over the last couple of months; I'm out of safe storage for the ones I don't want exposed to the elements but I needed access to the car on the lift.
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This is the current "fleet"!
1957 Bug
1973 Bug (x 2)
1975 Bug
1966 Rambler
1970 Cutlass (x 2)
1971 Cutlass
2018 Tundra doing a photo bomb :-D
Yes, the Bugs outnumber the Olds...the universe is back in balance. For now, at least :))
The white/primer '73 is at least complete and sort of solid, a good project for someone. The White '75 isn't as good as it looks (and apart from a salvage title and lack of engine, it's not too bad really). The maroon '73 is much better than it looks - 29,000 original miles and rust/accident free. Gotta be a helluva story as to how it wound up looking like it does now...I only know some of it.
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Took a couple more parts off the Cutlass and currently assembling a pile to take out for sandblasting. I should be running out of stuff to take off, finish cleaning then do some painting of the interior and engine bay. Reassembly is much anticipated, but the heads are still probably 3 months away so the engine is even longer.
Sold the Rambler and the white '75 Beetle...need to get rid of a couple more cars yet.
Biggest news was picking up the new gauges from SpeedHut. I took advantage of the ability to add custom logos to the gauge face. Now I need to fabricate some sort of mounting plate and modify the plastic bezel for slicker installation.
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How`s the fake walnut veneer ? usable?
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How`s the fake walnut veneer ? usable?
It's usable, but I won't be using it. There was a different woodgrain for each year from 70-72 and they're all available aftermarket but my dash doesn't currently have any wood grain on it. Normally the lower panel would have woodgrain from the wiper switch on the left to the right side of the glovebox. I'm going to leave it black thoughout.
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gauges look sharp.
I never could get the gauge sets mounted up very well. The vision in my head never materialized on the dash. Most times I think mine would have looked better with one of those three hole under dash mounts from JCWhitney. :lol_hitting:
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...and further down the rabbit hole he goes... :a102:
Firewall and frame getting cleaner but still a ways to go yet. Everytime I say "nothing else to remove", I find something else to remove. Replacing the heater core so now's the time to replace the blower motor as well, especially with the fender being off. More parts trickling in...got some assorted parts from RockAuto and waiting for shipments from Fusick, OPGI, Summit, OldsParts and Inline Tube, but the number of parts I have is starting to outnumber the parts I need. Of course, everything I do reveals more parts I need!
Mocked up one of the Wilwood disc brake units, looks good but was surprised they don't seem to use any backing plates. Anybody experienced that before?
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It sounds like my heads won't be ready until June (if I'm lucky) which means no engine until late summer...and there will still be lots of work to be done once I do get the engine. With there not being a rush to get everything back together at this point, I'm thinking I'll pull the body off the frame to get easier access for cleaning, painting and plumbing. Although the car is overall clean and in good shape, there's one area of the underside between the gas tank and rear valance that don't look like they've been touched by previous restorers. I'm hoping I don't open any new cans of worms by going down that rabbit hole, but the vast majority of MAWs are already done or on the list for this job.
I don't have any plan to strip the car down this far again so it's kinda now or never.
Anything I don't do now, like tubular A arms, bigger sway bars, different springs, are all things I can do at a later date if I decide I want to.
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The backing plates are basically used as gravel shields on disc brakes. We regularly removed them on our track day cars for better cooling. If you want to keep them you can probably use your originals and trim or shim to fit.
Lou Manglass
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Looking good, you`ll be glad you pulled that tank and cleaned it all up around there, it would bug you if you didn`t.
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Thanks, Lou. I've been looking at a couple other cars with the same setup so feeling better about it all now.
Looking good, you`ll be glad you pulled that tank and cleaned it all up around there, it would bug you if you didn`t.
Absolutely! I really do hate leaving areas untreated and susceptible to further corrosion, rot and/or failure if I can avoid it.
I've mostly decided not to separate body from frame as I'm more than a little concerned with the appearance of the various body mount bolts. I really don't want to shear any off or break the caged nuts loose. I can't get to the backsides of them without drilling holes or cutting access openings. Hell, I couldn't get one of the mid body rubber plugs out of the way lol. I'm still toying with the idea of drilling holes above the bolts so I can let them stew in penetrating oil before I give them a try...I don't know.
In the meantime, I found my lower ball joint dust covers are in bad shape so I'm going to have to take the control arms apart. We'll see how far down that particular rabbit hole I go. It's just money, right? :smiley_confused1:
All in all, it's progress. I'll be picking up a whole bunch of parts later this week and already starting the new shopping list...growing by the hour!
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Looking great Clay. That Olds will turn some heads when it's done.
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Looking great Clay. That Olds will turn some heads when it's done.
Thanks, Ray! I'm looking forward to that day but every step lately seems to be delaying that time more and more. What started as a low budget upgrade by swapping in parts I had on hand has turned into a frame off, big budget rebuild here.
Having found removing the spindles to be unavoidable, I'm taking the opportunity to replace all the front suspension bushings. I debated things like tubular control arms and coil overs but the price tag on anything that would actually provide an improvement really doesn't match the kind of driving I'll be doing. So I'll be sandblasting and painting parts for a clean and tidy appearance. I may upgrade the sway bar and springs but haven't made that decision yet.
Having reached a point where the entire suspension will be new, the only old bushings remaining were the body mounts. I gritted my teeth and committed to taking the body off the frame despite some misgivings. I seem to have got lucky with the body bolts - there are six of them (unless I missed a pair somewhere) and all but one came out. The front two by the firewall were the easiest because the inside nut/threads are visible and I've been spraying penetrating oil on them. Moving to the back, the first one I tried broke the cage nut loose. I solved that with my sawzall but I was pretty nervous about the next three...all of which came out without drama. I'll have to cut an access hole in the trunk to deal with the spun nut.
My Milwaukee tools are sure helping get the job done. It's nice not having to listen to the compressor or dealing with air hoses and extension cords!
Next up will be figuring out how to lift the body, build a support carriage for it that will allow me to work underneath then tackle all this extra work I've just unleashed!
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..and this is the kind of thing that always irritates me. You spend all the time to make the topside/outside look great but you don't go that extra mile to protect the nooks and crannies that aren't immediately visible. This car has been painted twice. The second repaint wasn't to help with resell although no idea about the first one. How hard would it have been to get into these areas? The condition of the rear valance between the fuel tank and the bumper is part of why I decided to move ahead with separating the body and frame.
Another reason was peeling off chunks of thick undercoat from the front area of the frame and finding surface rust under them. I'm sure there are plenty more areas like that and no better time or way to address them. I haven't decided whether to get the frame blasted or just hand clean it. I'm not building a show car, but I do want to be able to take pride in it's overall appearance!
I have other decisions to make regarding parts and upgrades while I'm at this point, but budgetary pressures mean I have to be careful/conservative in choosing what will work versus what I'd really like to have! I still have a big engine build bill ahead of me, and only a ballpark idea of what that will be. In the meantime I have a couple more cars to be sold, and tons of parts...so a few good days will make all the difference there :-)
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Does that last picture show a rare rear window defroster?
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Does that last picture show a rare rear window defroster?
Sure does! I had another '70 with one as well, I should take a look in my parts car to see if it's got one. My '71 has a factory rear window defrost grid. Might be more common up here in the Great White North.
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Got some more parts back from blast/paint, setup a date with the sandblaster for my frame then picked up all my new parts orders. Getting a mountain of parts and just itching to stop the de-construction and turn to bolting stuff together at last!
Seems like the pile of boxes should be a lot bigger considering how much their contents cost!!!
Bucket seat brackets, black windlace (painting the headliner black and replacing all the white/dirty windlace), manual transmission hump, console conversion saddle, interior hardware kit, several hardware kits for the fenders, inner fenders, hood, control arms, core support, grills etc (yes, I could have spent the time cleaning and reusing the old ones but this way I have all the fasteners I should need), brackets and hold down pins for the OAI hood, W27 rear end cover (these make the car go faster, right?)
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Big block battery tray, new battery cables, new engine wiring harness and front light harness, shiny alternator and power steering reservoir, AEM AFR gauge, carpet, door sill plates, steel brake lines, Hurst Line Loc, combination valve...
Still waiting on the BeCool radiator/cooling module, Hydratech brake booster and, of course, my heads. I'm going to blame all this extra work and expense on the guy supplying my heads because he's giving me too much time!
Already starting the new shopping list...1/2" braided fuel line and fittings, body mount set, whatever bushings I still need, shocks, maybe springs. And debating just getting a new gas tank and sway bars while I'm bleeding money anyways.
Friday afternoon I'll be picking up the rest of a batch of parts I bought last year. The guy bought someone else's half done project car and decided to change direction by going LS and tubular suspension. The stock control arms and some other pieces had already been cleaned and painted or powder coated and installed on the car but are now off and available. I'm assuming the control arms are going to have nice new bushings already done which will save me a bit of time and a few sheckles.
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Body came off the frame today, frame is now pretty much stripped and ready to go off for blasting and painting. Discovered that the body mount nut I thought had a broken cage was actually rotted body metal that I'll have to deal with. Probably a good thing to discover it now if it was that far gone.
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Yikes.
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Perfect time to address that rot on the entire frame. Good luck!!
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The frame is actually good, sending it off for sandblast and paint this week. The underside of the car is good too but I'm debating what to do with it. Lots of thick, hard undercoat in most areas. A few areas where that undercoat is mush due to ATF or something sprayed on it, but that stuff is coming off easily with a putty knife, and some areas where the undercoating didn't reach just need brushing then POR15 or similar to protect them. Metal is all good. My goal is to have it look half decent and remain solid. Not a show car.
The only real issue is that rear body mount area on the body (left side rear of trunk). As luck would have it, I saved that area from a parts car a few years ago so it should be a fairly straightforward patch.
...and Jabber...yep, you summed it up pretty darned succinctly :))
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Ugh. Need to keep perspective!
It's become obvious that using the rotisserie will make the job a LOT easier. I know I'm not the first to wander down the path of "oh yeah, I can deal with laying on my back for hours, days, weeks and I'll just knock this out in no time" followed by "wth was I even thinking???". So I hauled out the rotisserie I picked up for a song a few years ago. But before I can use it, I need to address the rusted body mount point in the body I indicated earlier.
Started stripping the undercoat and whatever other black sealant someone had used during the last overhaul and found more rust than I would have liked. The area around the body mount seems pretty straight forward with the donor metal I have, although I need to do some practice welds and work up some confidence to do the job. It's been many years since I've tackled anything like this, and back then it wasn't on my own vehicles so it didn't matter as much (friends were paying me with beer because they had fewer tools and skillz than me!).
Anyhow, I get to the end outer end of the brace, where it meets the trunk floor and drop, and there's rust holes. I knew there had been some patches done to the trunk, but the work was pretty well blended in. Now I'm seeing that the replacement metal wasn't welded as there seems to be a lot of panel adhesive in there, and minimal to no rust treatment. Overall, things feel solid and the rotten steel isn't really in a structural location...but I don't know how deeply I want to dig into this! It might not be quite right, but for what I plan to do with the car and the number of years I have left to enjoy it, I don't think it'll matter if I avoid going all in here.
So, I think I'm going to treat the rust I can reach, cut an repair a bit of steel but not going to go full monte on any of this. I don't want to damage the visible paint areas of the car (paint is great as is, no reason to open another big can of worms there), but I don't mind having to patch/recoat areas in the trunk. It's going to be hidden by carpet anyhow and the rest of the work won't be seen by anyone unless they crawl under the car.
Anyhow, long story short (too late?), repairing the rear brace/body mounts in preparation for mounting the body on the rotisserie.
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On the upside, I got my cooling system from BeCool. Still waiting on my Hydratech brake boost and master cylinder. Frame is still at the sand blasters and was untouched when I chatted with him last weekend. No rush, I have a wee bit of work to do before I'm really ready for it, so if he's storing it out of my way, all the better!
I need to clear out space so my friend can put his '65 Cutlass convertible on my lift and drop his 4 speed transmission to swap clutches and shift gear.
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Excellent Clay -- this project is going very well. You'll be rewarded with a beautiful car.
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I’ve used an oscillating tool and scraper blade to remove that undercoat. It works great. Way easier than chiseling with a putty knife
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I’ve used an oscillating tool and scraper blade to remove that undercoat. It works great. Way easier than chiseling with a putty knife
I actually picked up a Milwaukee M18 Multitool for this, but man it's noisy and it still leaves a lot of material behind. Might work better once the body is on the rotisserie but working it while on your back isn't a whole bunch of fun.
Excellent Clay -- this project is going very well. You'll be rewarded with a beautiful car.
Thanks, Ray! The irony is that the car's outwards appearance won't be significantly changed from the day I got it home apart from a bit of chrome polishing. I've added the wing, swapped back to original Olds rims, hopefully will get my OAI hood patched and fitted and the 442 grills. Of course it will be a whole new fire breathing machine underneath that skin :-D
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Excellent Clay -- this project is going very well. You'll be rewarded with a beautiful car.
Yes definitely a beautiful car , I remember when I used to visit the US regularly back in the 80s , a family I used to stay with in Eastern Washington had one in their driveway , was an old car by their standards by that time and didn’t get any use , I wished back then was there anyway I could have been mine ! Great to see what you are doing with it Clay !!!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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What do you do when you're at a standstill? Buy more parts, of course!
Just got a bunch of bushings, tie rods, etc from Rock Auto and suspension parts are on the way from Summit. My frame is still at the blaster's and I've been procrastinating on doing the body mount repair. Letting myself get distracted cleaning up a '73 VW to sell and doing some spring gardening. My heads are still a couple months away and still holding up the engine build. That's fine, though. With all the extra work I've added I'm not in any rush!
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Love to see shiny new parts for an old timer. Glad you're moving well along in the journey Clay.
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Love to see shiny new parts for an old timer. Glad you're moving well along in the journey Clay.
Thanks, Ray! They're going to make reassembly so pleasant! Picking up some more nice stuff tomorrow but I have to stop for a look at my frame on the way. My blaster sent me this photo of a broken weld near the front body mount.
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Slowly but surely...
Frame has been patched by a professional, just needs a final blast before paint and it should be back in my hands by next week.
Work is starting on my engine although I'm still waiting for my heads. Cleaned up and line bored at least
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Also got a few more parts. Gas tank and straps, UMI Performance front and rear springs, sway bars, tubular trailing arms and frame braces, and an engine cradle.
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Lookin' good Clay. That frame work came out very nice. Thanks for the great pics.
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Lookin' good Clay. That frame work came out very nice. Thanks for the great pics.
Thanks Ray! Doing my best after being influenced by the likes of you :93:
Now if I can stop dragging my heels and do that body repair I'll be able to get the shell on the rotisserie and start making some real progress again. I've welded body metal before, and these welds won't be visible but I'm still kind of nervous about the cutting and prep bit for some inane reason! Maybe this is the week it gets done.
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I see those fancy main studs.
Don't let Mondelo talk you into using a solid oil galley plug. You need to use the factory plug with the factory size hole or you will be replacing lots of timing chains.
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I can see why guys loved the olds engines for performance uses.
Sent from my Twisted Mind Of The Mudman
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I see those fancy main studs.
Don't let Mondelo talk you into using a solid oil galley plug. You need to use the factory plug with the factory size hole or you will be replacing lots of timing chains.
I'll keep that in mind, thanks! I don't recall Bernard mentioning them at all but I'll talk to my builder about it.
No progress on the body, grrrrr. Too many things pulling my every which way but loose or to the shop. First order of business is doing a major cleanup to make some serious working space, things are about to start moving (hopefully).
Went to a swap meet this morning (it's a big deal as there aren't many easy to get to around here), found a couple small prizes, picked up a new drop base air cleaner that might work even though it has the DeMon lettering on it. The big find was a set of American Racing Torq Thrust II 2 piece rims, pretty much exactly what I had in mind. The rubber is garbage but I only paid for the rims anyhow, probably about a third of what they would cost me new. 17 x 7 front, 17 x 8 rear.
Afterwards, we picked up my frame. It came out looking great but I'll have to wait to get some decent photos of it. Chomping at the bit to start getting that back together though! With a bit of luck it will be ready for the engine when the engine is done.
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Finally got back into the project. My heads are currently being reworked by Bernard Mondello so the wait for them is almost over. My hydroboost brake system is on it's way after a 7 month wait (they said 90-120 days when I ordered!).
The biggest thing is I finally tackled the metal replacement for the body mount on the left rear of the shell. I don't have a ton of experience (let alone recent experience) doing this so I was putting it off. Got home today and decided "today's the day", and it was. You can see the body metal rotted where it was in contact with the body mount puck, and the cage for the missing caged nut is fully exposed. This part isn't reproduced, but I had saved one from a parts car through some sheer dumb luck.
It's tacked in place, just need to finish the welding and I'll be able to get the car on the rotisserie at last. As Ray often says..."Onward!".
Oh, and as Ray has also being known to say, time for an adult beverage...
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I can see why guys loved the olds engines for performance uses.
Those Oldsmobile's are torque monsters. It will have no trouble melting those tires. :-*
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I can see why guys loved the olds engines for performance uses.
Those Oldsmobile's are torque monsters. It will have no trouble melting those tires. :-*
Yep! I should be looking at around 475 hp and 545 torque with this combination, but the dyno will tell us for sure!
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And that's that, I guess. Not the prettiest welds but they'll do the job. This area is tucked up behind the rear bumper and on the frame's rear cross member so not many people will ever see it.
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And that's that, I guess. Not the prettiest welds but they'll do the job. This area is tucked up behind the rear bumper and on the frame's rear cross member so not many people will ever see it.
Looks like my sheet metal welding skills.... Not pretty but functional. Like you said it's not a area that is seen often. So no biggy.
Sent from my Twisted Mind Of The Mudman
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And that's that, I guess. Not the prettiest welds but they'll do the job. This area is tucked up behind the rear bumper and on the frame's rear cross member so not many people will ever see it.
Looks like my sheet metal welding skills.... Not pretty but functional. Like you said it's not a area that is seen often. So no biggy.
Sent from my Twisted Mind Of The Mudman
...and it looks like I get another chance to make it look better. I have to cut it back out and fix the blinkety-blankety nut cage that let go as soon as I put a little bit of torque to it. Thought it was good but apparently not.
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And that's that, I guess. Not the prettiest welds but they'll do the job. This area is tucked up behind the rear bumper and on the frame's rear cross member so not many people will ever see it.
Looks like my sheet metal welding skills.... Not pretty but functional. Like you said it's not a area that is seen often. So no biggy.
Sent from my Twisted Mind Of The Mudman
...and it looks like I get another chance to make it look better. I have to cut it back out and fix the blinkety-blankety nut cage that let go as soon as I put a little bit of torque to it. Thought it was good but apparently not.
The idiot that thought those things were a good idea....
Sent from my Twisted Mind Of The Mudman
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You're not wrong, Muddy! And how many other hairbrained failures is he responsible for too? LOL One step forward, two steps back.
Before I installed it the first time, I ran a bolt through the nut and everything felt great. The cage had been weld repaired at some point in the past and although it didn't look particularly sound, I figured it had been good enough before, should be good enough now. Damned assumptions. Turns out the bolt wasn't the right bolt although I thought it was...just a size smaller I guess. When I found the right bolt, the fit was snug and applying a bit of pressure with the wrench was all it took to snap things off.
I didn't feel there was any other effective way to get in there and effect a reliable fix except to remove the freshly welded piece and do it properly. This time I ran a tap through the nut threads and made sure everything was good in that area. The existing cage was in rough condition, so I salvaged a nut cage from one of the scrap parts and tacked it into place. The welds are still lacking in beauty but should make up for it in effectiveness.
Welded the panel back in place but of course the gaps are wider now. Still need to grind and finish welding but I should be able to move forward now. Until the next hurdle tries to trip me, at least.
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If by chance you do another repair, before marking the cut. Clean the metal, much easier & helps the weld to wet out.
And boost the heat, tacking is a great time to adjust that.
Good repair job well-thought-out.
Finally got back into the project. My heads are currently being reworked by Bernard Mondello so the wait for them is almost over. My hydroboost brake system is on it's way after a 7 month wait (they said 90-120 days when I ordered!).
The biggest thing is I finally tackled the metal replacement for the body mount on the left rear of the shell. I don't have a ton of experience (let alone recent experience) doing this so I was putting it off. Got home today and decided "today's the day", and it was. You can see the body metal rotted where it was in contact with the body mount puck, and the cage for the missing caged nut is fully exposed. This part isn't reproduced, but I had saved one from a parts car through some sheer dumb luck.
It's tacked in place, just need to finish the welding and I'll be able to get the car on the rotisserie at last. As Ray often says..."Onward!".
Oh, and as Ray has also being known to say, time for an adult beverage...
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Thanks for the kind words and advice, pep! Hopefully I won't have to do any more like this, but I do have to install the bucket seat mounts later.
It's a basic welder with just two settings for heat. These welds were done with it on low, but I'll try some test welds on high before I finish this up.
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Good thinking..... "basic welder" in the right hands and some practice.........> It will weld
More heat is the ticket
Thanks for the kind words and advice, pep! Hopefully I won't have to do any more like this, but I do have to install the bucket seat mounts later.
It's a basic welder with just two settings for heat. These welds were done with it on low, but I'll try some test welds on high before I finish this up.
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Haven't touched the car since my last post. Had a busy week as a vendor at a big country music festival and now I'm switching gears as the car show I run is only a week and a half away! Making some time for it today so we'll see what I can accomplish.
Got the call I've been waiting for today, my heads are done and shipping this afternoon. It's been a long wait but I think it will be well worth it to know they're much improved over the "out of the box" state. The rest of the engine bit will go to my builder next week.
Happy Days!
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Good news Clay! Besides, it's often good to walk away from a project for a few days to get some time to think clearly and plan your next steps.
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Haven't touched the car since my last post. Had a busy week as a vendor at a big country music festival and now I'm switching gears as the car show I run is only a week and a half away! Making some time for it today so we'll see what I can accomplish.
Got the call I've been waiting for today, my heads are done and shipping this afternoon. It's been a long wait but I think it will be well worth it to know they're much improved over the "out of the box" state. The rest of the engine bit will go to my builder next week.
Happy Days!
Heads are a big power maker..
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Good news Clay! Besides, it's often good to walk away from a project for a few days to get some time to think clearly and plan your next steps.
You're not wrong, Ray...although this time my way ahead was clear there was just no real time to get out there. Sometimes I do find stepping away lets you return to a stalled task with fresh ideas and a successful approach for sure!
Heads are a big power maker..
I totally agree! These ones will flow so much better now, and I don't have to worry about manufacturing defects causing problems. Mine were the last pair he had on hand as he found too many were so far out of spec that he sent them back.
Got back out there and finished up the welding. Bit of rust paint and I'm ready to get the rotisserie under there now :-)
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Good news Clay! Besides, it's often good to walk away from a project for a few days to get some time to think clearly and plan your next steps.
You're not wrong, Ray...although this time my way ahead was clear there was just no real time to get out there. Sometimes I do find stepping away lets you return to a stalled task with fresh ideas and a successful approach for sure!
Heads are a big power maker..
I totally agree! These ones will flow so much better now, and I don't have to worry about manufacturing defects causing problems. Mine were the last pair he had on hand as he found too many were so far out of spec that he sent them back.
Got back out there and finished up the welding. Bit of rust paint and I'm ready to get the rotisserie under there now :-)
Onward, rotisserie you say sharpe ......... that will make things eaiser.... thumbs up
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A lot easier! It was taking forever laying on the creeper and working upside down. Here we are all rotisseried up now and hoping the stripping/cleaning/painting goes quickly!
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We need a popcorn eating emoji. I’m following along. :bravo_2:
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We need a popcorn eating emoji. I’m following along. :bravo_2:
;) Thanks, Heiny!
Took the day "off" yesterday and replaced the starter and carb in my '71. What a night and day difference in that car! The old starter was drawing way too many amps when cranking, and the old quadrajet was in poor shape. I installed an Edelbrock 1406 (650 cfm) that I had until I have time to rebuild the Qjet. Really woke that 350 up.
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FINALLY!!!!
Picked up my heads yesterday and took all the engine parts down to the machine shop today. A major step closer, although I'm not sure quite what the timeline is for the build. That's fine though, as the longer they have it the more time I have to get the chassis together!
Also picked up my hydroboost braking system from Hydratech.
Haven't had a lot of time this past month as I run a car show which we held last weekend...but now I should have more time to get onto with the grunt work of cleaning and prepping.
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Those hydro boost systems are the shit.
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Those hydro boost systems are the shit.
Friend has one in his '64 Lemans and swears by it, which is why I chose this particular system. Plus it lets me use the valve covers I wanted :-D
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Knowing the engine has a good chance of going together sooner rather than later has got me motivated somewhat! I'd been hoping to sell my '73 Super Beetle (it's a 30,000 original mile, rust free car but that's another story) but it's still hanging around so I decided it can spend some time outside. The frame is on my lift now and I just finished going through the parts pile distributing most of what needs to go on. I love working with new parts :93:
I need to go through assorted fasteners and brackets, clean and paint them before reusing them (brake line clamps, etc). I don't have my fuel line yet - going with 1/2" line to support the bigger carb and pump.
The last couple of days was a fight with the differential - I had to pull the axles to install the backing plates I forgot to give the diff builder, and one axle just didn't want to get back in place. I've never done axles before so bit of learning curve...it wasn't as easy as it was supposed to be. Anyhow, after a bunch of attempts and frustration I got them both done (one was easy, one was a major beotch!
Next is pressing bushings into the lower control arms...I think (hope) that will go quickly then bolting up the suspension.
I did take a couple photos, but there really wasn't anything to see in them so I'll have to deprive you of that for now. Well, ok...here's a photo of the Bug lol
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What a clusterf!
I wasn't happy with the end play in the axles...they're tapered bearings and the movement was between 1/16th and 1/8th of an inch...so I kept messing with them, talked with the guy I got all the parts from and it seems that the bearings were installed backwards. The incorrect orientation prevents things from tightening up the way they should, so looks like it's back to the builder to get this sorted out. I'm glad we discovered this now and not once the car was on the road!
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No doubt that's a great save.
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That is a little setback, but it’s better to fix it now before real damage is done.
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Good catch Clay! Better now than later when it potentially grenades.
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That is a little setback, but it’s better to fix it now before real damage is done.
Most definitely! The guy who assembled it will be fixing the bearings for me on Monday. He's got a good reputation and came recommended by people I trust so I think this was just one of those "shit happens" things.
I removed the old bushings from the differential ears last night, and installed the new urethane ones that came with the control arms. Used the drill method to remove the rubber and inner sleeve, pounded the crap out of the outer bushing with bfh and cold chisel, made very short work of that. I'm about halfway through setting up all the rear control arms, etc.
Also had a go at replacing the bushings on the front lower control arms, and what a mess I made of that. The first one (oval shaped) went in without drama. The second one (round) must have been off line and, although I should have known better, I used an impact driver to run it in. With a great "pop", it settled in place but not before distorting the metal of the control arm around the bushing. That was really disappointing because it's a nice, clean, good looking control arm. Tried my luck on the other control arm, started with the oval bushing because it worked on the first one, but this time I used a hand wrench for better control. This time the bushing got crooked too and started crushing the control arm - I had a socket on one side to prevent that, but looks like I should have had two. Anyhow, stopped and backed it out before any damage (hopefully) was done.
Rather than potentially making a bad situation worse, I dropped the control arms and bushings off at the shop that will be doing the front end alignment down the road and hopefully they'll be able to undo my heavy handed damage tomorrow and deliver me a working pair of control arms with bushings installed.
Talk about embarrassing. I was really tempted to bury them in the back forty late at night, buy replacements or tubulars and not speak a word of it to anyone!
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Talk about embarrassing. I was really tempted to bury them in the back forty late at night, buy replacements or tubulars and not speak a word of it to anyone!
Nothing to feel embarrassed about. We've all been there at one point or another when working on old car suspensions.
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Nothing to feel embarrassed about. We've all been there at one point or another when working on old car suspensions.
Thanks, Ray. I have the kind of personality where I expect to succeed at whatever I try, and am not happy with myself if I don't. That can lead to procrastination if I'm not sure I'll be able to do something on the first try. Kind of frustrating, but it is what it is!
Anyhow, I'll have the repaired/completed control arms back tomorrow or Tuesday and will be able to move forward there. In the meantime I had to take a few other parts down to the machine shop as they're working on my engine now. They were doing some stuff to the block yesterday, today they had the crank in this contraption. All the measuring/setup and machining should be done some time next week then on to assembly. Nice to see them moving forward!
With a little luck (and a little cooperation from the parts) I should have a rolling chassis ready to drop the engine into when it comes home.
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Progress! :PDT_Armataz_01_37:
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Progress! :PDT_Armataz_01_37:
Indeed!
I bought a UMI Performance package for the rear end - tubular control arms, frame braces, sway bar and stock height springs. I've been fighting them the past three days trying to get the springs in and still be able to align all the bolt holes which is not as easy as it sounds. The geometry of all those parts means things have to be in the right place, at the right time, for the right result. And I was losing this battle too, starting to feel a bit defeated.
BUT
I went back out there tonight, applied a bit more force compressing the springs and managed to get everything working in sync. Victory! I haven't tightened anything down yet, will snug them all up tomorrow but no torquing until the full body weight is back on the suspension.
The orange cargo straps held the springs back and everything in alignment so I could remove a few bolts to deal with some things I had forgotten to take care of earlier (applying some lube, reversing one lower control arm...).
Still waiting for the front lower control arms - their tech went home early, sick, today and they're closed on Monday so they said the arms would be on the bench first thing Tuesday. Still plenty of other tasks for me to keep busy with but I'm looking forward to being able to set the frame on wheels.
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That's going to be one hell of a car
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That's going to be one hell of a car
It's sure shaping up to be more of a beast than I originally intended! Not gonna complain at all though lol
I've been picking away at it as time permits lately. I sure did think I'd have more free time in retirement but man that sure turned out to be a myth! The last 4 weeks were essentially a write off as I'm involved with a Haunted House fundraiser which entails building a labyrinth of rooms in a barn at the local exhibition grounds, put in more hours than if I was working full time! Very worthwhile though as it raises tens of thousands of dollars for local charities each year.
Anyhow, I finally buttoned up the rear brakes last night. It's been a few years since I've done them so there was a fair bit of fitting, thinking, unfitting, beer, refitting, oops that's in wrong, involved. Once I got straightened out it went quickly though. Discovered that the spring kit I had was incomplete (got it with a bunch of new brake parts from that blue Cutlass I had and assumed it was good to go) and probably not even the right one for my car. Set the rear end down on rubber so she's sitting with her butt up in the air while I get the front together.
Nothing special about the rear brakes - all stock drum setup. Discs would be nice but currently out of the budget and probably not really essential for the driving I'll be doing. Coilovers would be nice too, but yeah...
My daughter gave me a hand getting the front springs and spindles in. That went pretty smoothly once I cut the spring compressors centre shaft down so it wouldn't bottom out on the frame and figured out where to put the fingers (the compressor's fingers...mine stayed well clear!) so they wouldn't interfere either. Wilwood disc brakes are the order of the day here along with UMI springs and all new steering components. I'm considering getting a quick ratio steering box but the jury is still out on that one for now.
The engine is still at the machine shop, sounds like they'll be grinding the crank this week so still a little ways out. I'm hoping to get finished with the frame soon as the weather has gone for crap and with this project monopolizing the shop my two good cars are sitting outside sharing a short shelter.
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Don't know why I didn't do this before...probably because I was planning on bolting all four up to my '71 for a road test to check clearances first. Anyhow, as much as I love the look of the stock wheels I've opted for these American Racing Torque Thrust II wheels and realized I can bolt them up now to check whether there are any fitment issues with frame or suspension. They look like they'll work just fine. At the rear, at any rate.
17 " x 8" rear, 17" x 7" front.
Now to figure out what size rubber to wrap them with.
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Looking good.
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Installed a set of Wilwood disc brakes for the front, direct bolt on to the drum brake spindle. Went well for the most part, definitely pays to read the instructions cover to cover before starting. I had to back track a couple of times but nothing serious. Wheel and tire clearances look good, but I still want to bolt the rims up to my '71 so I can confirm the clearances to the body are also good.
Have to go talk to the tire shop next, but I think I'll be going with 205/50R17 rubber for the front and 255/50R17 for the rear. The tire width and diameter for those sizes comes close to matching the 205/70R14 and 255/30R15 sizes I was going to use on the stock rims although the sidewalls will be shorter which makes up for the larger rims of course.
The frame is now sitting on all four wheels, and it feels good to look at that. Next up is painting and assembling the steering components and installing the brake lines. Still have to decide what I want to use for fuel line and fittings. Going to 1/2" lines to support the thirsty engine better, will probably use braided line from the tank to the pump with a primary filter midway along the frame as there's no sock filter on the new fuel pickup. Then the frame will sit waiting for the engine to arrive, and I'll get back to work on the body's underside.
The goal is to drive this car by late spring 2024!
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Very good work Clay! It looks fantastic. Love the pics, - thank you!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Very good work Clay! It looks fantastic. Love the pics, - thank you!
Thanks, Ray! Not quite as detailed as some of your posts, but we all love seeing photos of projects coming together!
I rigged the tie rods/centre link together temporarily so I could steer the frame and rolled it outside for a little bit of car tetris. I picked up the Torque Thrust rims used, so I wasn't certain they were going to work but after bolting them up to my '71 I know I can go ahead and get new rubber for them.
Next to paint the steering components and a bunch of smaller hardware, install the steering and brake lines then turn my attention back to cleaning the floor pans and getting the body ready for reuniting.
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A couple more shop shots
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Tighter than a gnat's a$$ in there -- LOL Great pics of the shop and the work.
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Did you box the frame any?
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Tighter than a gnat's a$$ in there -- LOL Great pics of the shop and the work.
Yep, and all the other sheds are full of "crap" as well. Fortunately it's all crap the people keep buying off me so I can fund the project. Wife says I have too much stuff and while I might silently agree with her I can never admit it out loud. Instead, I point out that I just don't have enough space.
Remember how big that 30 x 30 looked when I rolled the VW in for the first time?
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Did you box the frame any?
I debated it, but the build budget was already getting out of control so decided to skip the expense. It sounds like I should be fine - the engine is being built for good street driving and I won't be racing or trying to wheelstand it O:-)
The rear control arm kit included frame braces though.
The car in the video is pretty damned sweet. I'm trying not to get my expectations too high for mine but I know it's not gonna be a slouch :-)
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looking for red wheel well liners ?
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those wilwood brakes look great, :-*
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those wilwood brakes look great, :-*
Hopefully they work as good as the look :-D
I'm not looking for red fender wells although they might look good in there with the other red parts going into the engine bay. If I came across a set of cheap repops around here I might consider picking them up...never know!
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red fender wells ................ might look good in there with the other red parts going into the engine bay.
Those red liners would look bad ass with a big set of chrome header collectors at your feet.
keep after that ride and it'll be a real stunner. looks real good. nice and clean. :-*
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red fender wells ................ might look good in there with the other red parts going into the engine bay.
Those red liners would look bad ass with a big set of chrome header collectors at your feet.
keep after that ride and it'll be a real stunner. looks real good. nice and clean. :-*
Now you've got me pondering that, lol. For the price of new ones I'd rather pick up the rest of the parts to complete a functional OAI setup (I have the hood) but if I spy some used ones out and about...
Ceramic coated headers going in with the engine.
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I have a really good olds 442 connection up here so if you need something special I'll hook you up.
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Another one of those mixed bag updates. Got distracted by a few other higher priority things, had to move the frame outside a few times in the rain and shop is a big mess again, lol. I need to spend some quality zen time cleaning the mud splashes off the frame (rain mixing with accumulated dust and hand prints from moving it) then get back onto cleaning/painting steering components, brake lines and source my fuel line.
I've spent a few more hours scraping the bottom of the floor pans, still many hours ahead of me but at least I can see some progress there!
My swap meet rims have become more expensive than I planned. They're two piece American Racing Torque Thrust II's (https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/are-vn5057861?retaillocation=int) that list for about $616 Cdn each before taxes and shipping. I got the set for $1000 Cdn, which was less than the similar one piece rims would have cost new. Rims were a nice to have upgrade as I would have been just as happy running the OEM SS2 rims. Anyhow, figured out what size rubber I wanted to run on the 17" rims, ordered them in and dropped the rims off with the tire shop. Turns out three of the rims need to be straightened up and massaged...one of the rear wheels wanted a 6 ounce weight to balance it out. Apparently that will run as much as $300 a rim. On the bright side, they come back looking (and performing) like new...but that means the last rim needs to be sent out for inspection and cleanup.
As disappointing as all that is, I do like how those rims look, and any other aftermarket rims would cost me more than the cost of repairs to these ones...so I'm going ahead with that. I hate spending unplanned money that could be used for parts I want!!!
Like a close ratio steering box. I'm checking out my options on those, and will likely go with a Bergeson 12.1:1 ratio.
Meanwhile my engine is starting to go together. Some photos from Thursday, they have the first piston in, were just getting the degree wheel setup and prepping to set the endplay. But we need a water pump, which is easier said than done as there are three different lengths of pump, depending on whether you're running AC or not, and whether the engine is 1970 or earlier. Pick the wrong one and your pulleys won't line up. The earlier pumps also have a different OD on the output pipe than the later ones. I haven't found a "upgrading oldsmobile cooling system parts for dummies" list anywhere so trying to sift through option!
I have a BeCool radiator so I also need to take the input/output pipe ODs into account there to make sure I can get hoses that will work without a whole bunch of messing around.
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While I was doing the rear body mount repair I had noticed that some panel repair had been done, apparently with extensive use of panel bond sealant vice welding. With the body on the rotisserie the weak metal is more obvious. Although I don't think this area is critical, and the void space behind it is open to the elements in various places, I think I'll wind up doing some limited metal replacement around this area.
Why didn't I do that area when I did the mount repair? Well, primarily because my replacement panel didn't extend that far. When I cut the old metal from the donor car a few years ago I wasn't even thinking I might need or want that area and it was just blind luck that I even had the section for the mount.
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I have a really good olds 442 connection up here so if you need something special I'll hook you up.
Thanks...one of the guys in Vancouver area?
The car isn't a 442 and isn't stock so there probably won't be much in the way of 442 parts I ever need, but I'll keep that in mind :-)
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All going well we'll be putting fire in the holes sometime next week. Builder will break it in, tune and dyno it.
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No these guys are Chris at I can auto.
If you saw his yard you'd go bonkers.
What are your guesses for hp and tq?
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It's got a mild cam, and the headers might be slightly smaller than ideal. Based on conversations with Bernard Mondello (he supplied the parts and reworked the heads) I think we'll be around 475 hp and 545 torque.
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Yes... that should be adequate..... :93:
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That looks like it is going to hurt your neck.
Did Mondelo sell you a split timing chain cover that lets you replace the cam with the motor in the car?
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That looks like it is going to hurt your neck.
Did Mondelo sell you a split timing chain cover that lets you replace the cam with the motor in the car?
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Nope. I thought about getting one but I don't think I'll be swapping the cam on a regular basis.
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That looks like it is going to hurt your neck.
Did Mondelo sell you a split timing chain cover that lets you replace the cam with the motor in the car?
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Nope. I thought about getting one but I don't think I'll be swapping the cam on a regular basis.
On those old GM cars of that era you can swap the cam with the engine still in the car. I removed the grill and radiator and tied back the condenser and that gave me enough room to swap cams on my old 68 Chevelle years ago. That Cutlass should be no different.
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I really like your valve covers. Where did they come from?
Lou Manglass
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On those old GM cars of that era you can swap the cam with the engine still in the car. I removed the grill and radiator and tied back the condenser and that gave me enough room to swap cams on my old 68 Chevelle years ago. That Cutlass should be no different.
The challenge with the Olds is that the timing cover is very difficult to get back on unless you drop the oil pan. It can be done, but it's a real PITA. The two piece cover makes that part of the job a snap.
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I really like your valve covers. Where did they come from?
Lou Manglass
They were made by GMPP (GM Performance Products). As far as I know, these have been out of production for some time but you can find NOS and used for sale on the net...I got this pair from someone on the classicoldsmobile.com forum last year.
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that 442 sure aint like my dads olds. that'll be in chevy's face :cool2:
looks real good
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Excellent -- good luck with the startup and the run-in..
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Excellent -- good luck with the startup and the run-in..
Sounds like they flashed it up and ran it through a break in program late yesterday, have some things to tweak and tighten up I guess. They're supposed to call me Monday morning and hopefully we'll get some dyno pulls and numbers then :-)
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I mentioned the swap meet rims needed some work. That turned into about $400 a wheel, one wheel was marginally less. Lesson learned about buying used rims with well used tires. Even with that though, I'm still under what they would have cost me new once taxes and shipping were done. I never wanted to spend that much on rims though, but these will look good on the car.
A big difference in appearance from when I first got them!
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Meanwhile at the engine shop...
They called me yesterday needing a new oil fill tube as the old one was puking oil everywhere. So I pulled one out of my parts engine and went down with the expectation of seeing/hearing the engine run at last. But, not to be.
Hopefully I'll get the call to come down for dyno pulls tomorrow. On the up side, I'm a long way from having the car back together anyhow so the engine hasn't been a hold up. Maybe an excuse to allow scope creep to mess me up, but meh. MAWs!
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At long last we got my engine on the dyno and I got to hear and see it's thunder! Specs are below...just for fun, what kind of power do you think it made?
1969 455 bored .030 over using a stock CN crank running 10.1:1 compression.
CP Bullet Pistons
Scat H Beam Rods
Quick Fuel SS 850 Carb
Edelbrock Performer RPM Intake
MSD Ready to run distributor
Harland Sharp 1.6 Rocker Arms
Hydraulic Roller Cam with 4/7 swap Intake .560/278.6 Exhaust .566/284.6
Edelbrock Heads (newest version) blueprinted by Bernard Mondello
It made it's best power at 32 degrees timing. Dropped a couple HP and torque at 34 degrees.
Dyno Pull:
Adjusting Timing (Inside the dyno room for pure engine rumble!):
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Oh yeah...504 hp at 5300 rpm, 570 torque at 3800 rpm. I could get more power out of it with 1 7/8" headers instead of the 1 3/4" I have and swapping up to an RPM intake but I'm more than happy with these numbers!
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Great numbers Clay. Trying to milk the setup for a few more HP is not going to mean a heck of a lot given the intent of the car build.
A very nice Christmas gift for yourself -- congrats.
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Ready to rock, got the power to haul that hotrod down the road for sure.
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Respectable numbers for a drivable street car for sure.
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Great numbers Clay. Trying to milk the setup for a few more HP is not going to mean a heck of a lot given the intent of the car build.
A very nice Christmas gift for yourself -- congrats.
Yes, one helluva Christmas gift :-D
The numbers are already higher than I was aiming for (not a bad thing) but chasing higher results would only be worth the time and money if I was looking to shave tenths of a second off my quarter mile times...which I'm not! The car will likely never see the track.
Having said that, the new speedometer is a GPS unit and reports things like quarter mile time O:-)
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I've been seeing it for a while - the best time to order the interior you want in the next couple of months would have been about a year ago. Sold some stuff that freed up enough cash for me to spring for the Legendary Interiors upholstery and door panels at their Boxing Day sale rates (20% off regular). Lead time on the door panels is 77 days, so they should be arriving just about when I'll be nearly ready for them. The seat upholstery is 280 day lead time...so next winter's project I guess.
That's ok. What I have now is serviceable, but not perfect and will get me through the summer (he says optimistically envisioning running through the gears and letting some smoke out of the tires in 2024!!!)
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50 + years ago---Elroy had a new drivers license, we pulled into a quickie mart. dude pulls in a minute later with this cool ass 67 olds with a bitchen exhaust. 400 minimum on a big cam.
that thing sounded and looked bad ass :-*
12 Bolt
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I like the '67s, sounds like that car left an impression!
So this happened today...
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Starting to feel more like a car again...sorta! Engine is in and the transmission is installed, so now I can sit by the gear shift and make motor sounds for my own amusement at least! Transmission is a Tremec TKX 5 speed which doesn't require any tunnel mods to fit, apart from adding the shifter hump which I need to figure out the right location for.
Underbody is almost ready for paint. Switched to using a wire wheel for removing the undercoat...makes the job go a lot quicker. Some lessons learned though...Milwaukee M18 grinders don't like extended use like that. All the magic smoke escaped from mine (and of course it's out of warranty). This was a regular M18, not the brushless Fuel.
Also, when you're using a wire wheel on a grinder with no guard, and wearing thin gloves, and the thought crosses your mind that maybe you should be wearing leather gloves...maybe you SHOULD be wearing leather gloves. Ouch. Split second of contact removed a nice swath of skin from one of my fingers. Coulda been worse.
I'll be using a two part epoxy primer for the underbody. I currently have some which I was told would be a fairly dark grey but it looks more like USN destroyer grey or a bit lighter. It will only be visible to someone looking underneath the car (which I have to keep reminding myself is not meant to be a trophy winning show car) or me when I have the car up on the lift but I'm not sure I'll be happy with the lighter shade there. I'm mainly after something that will provide a more subtle contrast to the frame and suspension. Probably overthinking it, but that's what I do. Black would work too I guess.
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Love those valve covers Clay -- classic! Frame came out excellent as well.
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What GF said! I have never seen VC that had Olds cast into them. Very cool for sure!
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Thanks! I'm still debating whether to leave them bare or to paint and expose the top relief but I have plenty of other higher priority tasks to deal with before I get to that point.
There are a few covers with Oldsmobile embossed on them, I definitely like these ones. They were made by GMPP but haven't been available for a few years now. I lucked into this NOS pair. They cost me an arm and a leg...probably would have been better putting the money elsewhere but no regrets! I had to switch to a hydroboost braking system because even an 8" booster hits the covers, so there were some pricey consequences to this choice.
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Plugging away...fitted up the headers and didn't need to do any reshaping to get them to fit. They're ceramic coated from Patriot, a subsidiary of Pertronix. Started mocking up some of the accessories and test fitting other parts and so far it looks like everything is working the way it should. I was concerned the tall valve covers were going to create fitment issues with the alternator bracket.
I'm looking forward to reuniting the body and the frame so I can start fitting all the other brake and steering components together. I'm sure I'll be needing to get creative and do some fabrication with some of it at any rate. The brake combination valve can't be installed in the factory position, for example, and I need to plumb a line lock in there somewhere too. But I'm getting ahead of myself.
Work progresses on the underside, and the metal is starting to look pretty clean under there. I'm doing what should be my final front to back pass getting down to bare metal and cleaning out the nooks and crannies I can. Hopefully just a couple more nights at it and I can flip the body to get at the stuff I can't see now. I also need to weld in the bucket seat mounting brackets and cut a hole for the shifter before I paint the bottom with a two part epoxy etching primer.
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Media blasting would have been a lot easier. I've burnt out one Milwaukee M18 grinder and my 30+ year old corded grinder with the flaky switch no workey now either. Feels like this part of the job will NEVER end!
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Well done!
I used the same cleaning process for the frame on my '58 F-100 and it seemed like it took forever. Fortunately, I had a lot of help with it. When one helper tired out, another took their place. I probably only had to do half of it but the prep was worth it. It's almost 40 years later and it still looks pretty good.
Lou Manglass
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Fantastic -- that rotisserie is a great addition. When I did my Jag, I found that my garage wasn't big enough for a proper rotisserie. I cobbled together a makeshift version and it was painful to work with. Your setup is downright luxurious Clay. Congrats!!!
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:cool2: :bravo_2:
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Keep going. That's going to turn out being a real nice car if that body looks anything like that big block rocket. kool
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Keep going. That's going to turn out being a real nice car if that body looks anything like that big block rocket. kool
Thanks, Elroy. I started off with a clean car that I couldn't say "no" to. I haven't had to touch the paint and although it will never be a Best Paint contender it still holds it's own. Not quite the colour I would have painted it myself but I don't hate it!
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Well done!
I used the same cleaning process for the frame on my '58 F-100 and it seemed like it took forever. Fortunately, I had a lot of help with it. When one helper tired out, another took their place. I probably only had to do half of it but the prep was worth it. It's almost 40 years later and it still looks pretty good.
Lou Manglass
Thanks, Lou! I don't need to get 40 years out of mine but I'll be very pleased to get 10 or 15 then it's someone else's problem :-D I haven't had anyone rushing to help with this part of the job but I also tend to do most of my work later at night. I do have a couple friends just itching to get going on reassembly though...one of them is my "audio expert" and loves wiring.
Fantastic -- that rotisserie is a great addition. When I did my Jag, I found that my garage wasn't big enough for a proper rotisserie. I cobbled together a makeshift version and it was painful to work with. Your setup is downright luxurious Clay. Congrats!!!
I picked up that rotisserie for a song several years ago, figured at least one of my cars was going to need it and I'm very glad to have it now. I always marvelled at how well organized and how much you were able to accomplish in the space you had, Ray. You must be enjoying having a bit more room now!
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Flipped her over so I could get at the rest of the areas without having to work upside down. It's amazing how many spots I missed even with my face right up close to the work. The lighting sometimes makes it hard to distinguish between scuffed black paint and shiny new metal, my aging eyes don't help either!
Progress is being made but I'm not sure if that light is the end of the tunnel or an oncoming train! Still need to go at the rear axle arch area, trunk pan and valance area then pick more undercoat and crap out of the corners and crevices. At some point I have to say "enough is enough", do a final degrease then get some paint on the thing so I can move forward. I'm getting so sick of this part of the job, but I know I'll have peace of mind knowing exactly what's under the car when I hit the street.
Spring is coming and I'm gonna drive this beast this year!
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That certain is the way to go :cool2:
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That certain is the way to go :cool2:
Sand/media blasting is actually the way to go :-)
I would have had a hard time getting the body and rotisserie out of the shop and onto a trailer or ramp truck, and with the topside of the body already painted I opted for this route.
Thank goodness for the spitroaster, though. I started the job working on my back and quickly realized the futility of that method. :021:
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If i had cubic dollars i'd dip everything.
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If i had cubic dollars i'd dip everything.
I'm not sure I would even if I could. At least not unless I could dip all the pieces in etching primer to get all the hidden metal protected again.
Dipping also exposes every problem and sin, which is good if your work scope plans for that. This handraulic method lets me be a little pickier about leaving some cans of worms closed!
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I've been seeing some videos with dry ice blasting. It leaves very little mess behind. But all the videos I've seen were somewhat delicate items. Not sure how it would work for underbody grime.
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I've been seeing some videos with dry ice blasting. It leaves very little mess behind. But all the videos I've seen were somewhat delicate items. Not sure how it would work for underbody grime.
I've seen it too, but also not surehow much it penetrates. I think the video I saw was on Dennis Collin's Coffee Walk (Youtube). They were using it to clean the undercarriage of a low mile 1982 Mercedes, and it appears to just remove dirt and grime while leaving paint and coatings intact. I think one of the restrictive elements of the method is the scarcity of dry ice in some areas.
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have not commented in a while but an awesome project. i do not have the attention span to complete that large of a project and am in awe of those that can.
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have not commented in a while but an awesome project. i do not have the attention span to complete that large of a project and am in awe of those that can.
If I didn't have similar issues with getting distracted, this probably would be much further along by now!
I'm calling the underside "done" apart from degreasing and picking any loose material out of crevices, which I'll be working on tonight and tomorrow. The original plan was for my sandblaster friend to come up tomorrow with some tint to darken the epoxy (it's currently a medium grey, I want something closer to the body colour), mix it up and help me paint the underside and firewall. Apparently his wife made some other plans so that task will probably need to wait a few days...hopefully not too long, but I do have plenty to keep busy with on the chassis before the mating can occur.
In the meantime I've welded the bucket seat brackets in place, a requirement as this was originally a bench seat car. The bench is held down by four bolts, two at each end. The buckets only use one of those bolts per side, and studs for the other three legs on each. Took a bit of measuring and assembly/disassembly until I felt confident to start welding.
My welding skills are still damned near non-existent, but I think I had a couple of epiphanies which have helped improve my technique. All the welds will hold, and a couple of them even look ok-ish. They'll be covered with paint and carpet so they won't be distracting!
The console needs to be trimmed to be used with the manual shift and the two mounting brackets positioned in due course. As the body is still on the rotisserie I think I'll hold off on that part until it's back on the chassis and I can climb right in there.
But...sneak peak, buckets and console...upgrade from white bench seat column shift :clap:
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Finally slapped some paint on the underside of the body pan today! I had wanted something a few shades darker but apparently we hit the limit on the amount of tint that could be added. Since I'm just building a showy car and not a show car, we brushed and rolled the two part epoxy on. I don't really care if I'm the only one that ever sees it, it's gonna make me happy when the car's on the lift and I look underneath. Basically wanted some contrast from the black frame.
This was the first of two coats, I'll do the second coat in a couple of days then it will be time to spin the body around and position it where it needs to be for rolling the chassis under it. Before the chassis can go in I'll have to clean and paint the contact points blocked by the rotisserie, and the firewall will get sprayed a semi gloss black.
All the fuel lines, hose ends and assorted fittings should be here next week and I'll be able to finish up the work on the frame, so I'm anticipated reuniting the two in under three weeks.
The new seat foam also arrived but it's going off to storage until the upholstery arrives...probably right about this time next year.
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Applied the second coat of epoxy then got the car "flat" and spun around so the body and chassis are both oriented in the same direction. I'm giving the epoxy some time to harden before I set the body down on blocks and remove the rotisserie. Then I'll have to clean/paint the contact points I couldn't do with the rotisserie in place, spray the firewall a semigloss black and the body will be ready to lower onto the chassis.
While I'm waiting for the epoxy to harden, it's time to get the chassis cleaned up and ready for the reunion. Brake lines need to be connected and tightened, which also includes fabricating new frame brackets for the front flex lines because (of course) the new fitting are smaller than the factory holes in the originals.
Also picked up my fuel lines and fittings today so we'll get that all plumbed up too. That stuff is NOT cheap, let me tell ya!
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Got the body off the rotisserie and back on the sturdy horses. Next step was to paint the firewall which necessitated building an overspray containment area (too primitive to call it a paint booth). Previous owners had painted the firewall area a grey similar to the body colour but it was a flat finish and had too many flaws. The original firewall colour was satin black and as I don't have a match on the body colour I went with black.
The fender flanges under the hood were similarly not finish painted and that was going to drive me crazy every time I opened the hood. And with this engine, the hood will be spending a lot of time open...when not screaming down the road of course. Since the plastic inner fenders are black (unless I decide to paint them red), the core support and many other aspects also black, I masked off the under hood portions and sprayed them with the same paint as the firewall.
I'd rather have the body colour carry on to the inside but this is the next best solution I think.
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Just have to clean and paint the areas where the rotisserie attached to the body and it will be ready for mating back to the frame.
The frame is also almost ready to go, still working on hose ends and need to add fluids to the rear end and transmission. I'll probably spray some two part clear coat on the aluminum diff cover first.
Fitting the fuel pump up has been time consuming; I've lost count of how many times it's been off and back on this week. The pump is a high volume unit from RobbMC Performance and designed for many applications. The newest version of Edelbrock heads are the first with a recess meant to facilitate this sort of pump as it couldn't be used with previous versions of the heads. I don't know if I'm the first but until I contacted Robb he hadn't had a chance to see the fuel pump/head combination.
Basically, the V point of the recess is in contact with the pump preventing it from seating on the block properly. Robb indicated I should be able to safely remove 1/16" from the pump cover. I've been carefully removing material from the pump and the head to provide clearance and eliminate contact between the two...so check the pump, remove it. File a wee bit of material off. Install the pump, note where the contact point is. Remove pump. Repeat. Almost got it now and the rest will go easily. While this isn't an essential part before reuniting the body and frame, it will let me position the fuel lines and clamp them along the frame easier.
The pump body rotates so I can put it in any position as required for making the hose connections. I've got to give props to Robb for responding to my inquiries quickly, even over a long weekend. Great customer service there.
Photos here are of the pump before any modifications, and the fender flanges after painting.
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Here's a photo of the fender when I got the car. You can see how the darker grey body colour wraps down the vertical only about 1/8" and below that is another, duller grey and unfinished/lighter coloured appearing surfaces toward the hinge.
Although it doesn't look awful in these photos, the look didn't hold up in person!